Gilesa Sibbalda
I really like the idea of a traditional duet. I think it is unused.
pablo simon
Now we are abusing it.
Galen Ayers
Does it mean that we are abusing or abusing him? {everyone laughs}
Gilesa Sibbalda
So, Paul: you went to Mallorca in the summer of 2020 and to a remote fishing village and spent 18 months there painting, writing songs, going on café tours and revising before returning to London. You've known each other for quite a few years, so did the idea of recording together feel natural, instinctive?
pablo simon
The fact is that when I was in Majorca it occurred to me to invite a friend there to sing some songs. But then I came back to London and nobody was practicing or anything, so I was like, "Okay, I'll have to think again." But then, by chance, a good mutual friend told me that Galen was in town, so we met up and talked. At the time, it was more about me playing bass on the record because Galen was also working on some songs. But then after a few days, it all clicked and we both said, "you know what, we're both here, let's try it." So yeah, it came naturally, really.
Gilesa Sibbalda
Is there a malicious match?
pablo simon
Well, that's really interesting, because the whole process of making the album was hanging on a thin piece of cotton. It seemed like we had so many problems: Simon Tong was on tour, Seb (Rochford, drums), Tony (Visconti, producer) got Covid and couldn't come the first day and there were other mishaps. But somehow, magically, we all stayed together to finish the album.
Galen Ayers
Paul and I hadn't seen each other in years, so when we met, we were both available in the same place, mentally and practically, where we could, well, experiment at first and then when we realized we really wanted to make a album, we experienced what Paul just said. But all this time we always showed up. We have a roundtable at Paul's house and every day we would show up and keep writing songs. We've had a good, solid six months I'd say, so whatever happens, we'll have a lot of songs.
Gilesa Sibbalda
Did it feel a bit like an experiment that I did?
pablo simon
Each album is a bit like an experiment. But that was great because we like to bounce ideas off each other, and if there was something we were both kind of stuck on, suddenly there would be a third idea that we never would have thought of without talking about.
Galen Ayers
Yes, I think it depends on how you define the experiment. But I think we had a similar intention, which was to create something that none of us had done before. I think we were both very open about how we achieved our result.
Gilesa Sibbalda
This has probably been written before, but recording it is like looking at fragments of life. I think that kind of storytelling is very exciting, you know where you can see yourself in the story and how it unfolds. Did you feel like the protagonist of these stories or the narrator of what you were observing?
pablo simon
I think the characters in the songs were begging for it. I can't stop noticing what's around me. We're both like that, you know. Galen has a talent for weaving words, like a poet. I'm simpler, I think.
Gilesa Sibbalda
They both have this immense love and talent for music, the written word, art, natural objects. Another thing that connects you with your art is your activism.
pablo simon
We are, exactly!
Galen Ayers
I'm not pulling on Paul {they both laugh as Paul falls apart} but I think we both have a holistic approach to life and I think you've just identified that. I think we both agree that activism doesn't have to be a grand gesture, it can be your everyday decisions. And it's the same with my favorite albums that grew, and still grow {laughs}, they are the ones that invite you into the world. So to create that world, you really have to pay attention to the details in the visuals, in the lyrics, and it all becomes a holistic view. I hope that when the listener gets to the record, they can enter another world.
Gilesa Sibbalda
That's a great way to describe it, Galen, and I think you did that very effectively with these songs, incorporating those influences. I recently spoke with a guitarist who told me how important it is to him and he believes that for all musicians to travel and immerse themselves in different cultures.
pablo simon
They're like ingredients, really. I guess we both had different kinds of experiences and some of the same experiences of listening to music since we were little. Those things are in the back of my head, so when a new idea for a song comes up and we're working on lyrics, all of a sudden this idea comes up: "I need a tambourine." And you're like, "yeah, this part needs a tambourine," or he's like, "I need a cello," or something like that. So anyway…..{mischievous look}…..I told the cello “no” {laughs}
Gilesa Sibbalda
Anger! I play the cello!
Galen Ayers
Oh no… I'm sorry! The cello is beautiful.
Gilesa Sibbalda
I thought I'd call!
pablo simon
Save it to your own album!{laugh}
Galen Ayers
The aesthetic we ultimately wanted to create was pretty simple. It's not simple in a pejorative way, but simply with a lot of space and allowing Tony Visconti's production to provide that space. All my friends said that you can hear each instrument in its place, doing its leading role, you know, coming in, being the star of the show, and then coming out. Being able to combine our two voices for the first time, we were very excited to show them off in a different way. On some of them I just sing backing vocals and Paul plays lead, and on others we do a duet in the traditional sense of the word. And I drive some.
Gilesa Sibbalda
What have you learned about yourselves while working together?
pablo simon
Well, for me it was like a challenge to do something that I wouldn't normally do. Get out of your comfort zone. Recording this album was definitely that. The song was the part that took me out of my comfort zone. Writing music is always one way or another: you have an idea and you have to figure out how to convey what you feel.
Galen Ayers
I agree, I felt the same way, I would also say it was a struggle at times, but it was a learning curve to be able to embrace all of Paul's influences along with my own as well as complementing my own. Another learning curve was singing in Spanish. Now in no way do I claim that I can sing in the tradition of the amazing and beautiful voices of Spain, such as flamenco. So by no means do I assume that this is how I sound. We spent a lot of time playing around with the rhythm and simplifying the words so they could play in a way that I thought was true to the key of the Spanish song, if that makes sense. Spanish, not as much as English, has a very natural aspect in the way they communicate. So I wanted to convey that in the song. I don't want to try to fit too many words into one verse, for example. or allowing the lengthened vowels to sit on a vowel for a while and create that feeling without having to explain the feeling.
pablo simon
Improve the writing process, really.
Gilesa Sibbalda
I think the lyrics are just an integral part of the song and I like the approach of giving them their own space and letting the listeners make their own interpretations; it makes you think more and hopefully has a deeper impact. And my interpretation will be different than my next-door neighbor.
Galen Ayers
Yeah, and sometimes you read the musicians' memoirs and they really tell you what they were thinking when they wrote the song, what they really wanted to say, and it kind of adds something, but it alters the feathers in a different way. It's so strange. It's kind of bittersweet when you find out.
Gilesa Sibbalda
Galen, you mentioned that singing in Spanish requires study. Worried about how your Spanish might be perceived?
Galen Ayers
I know what you want to say. I didn't really think much of the concept, although there was a time when I finally pitched it to some Spanish friends. And they said, "Oh, we like your accent." And I was in shock! I thought: “No, I don't have an accent! What are you talking about?! I grew up with a transatlantic accent, I think they call it. You can hear it. Spanish was my first language and I also spoke Mallorcan, so I'm used to my accent being everywhere. So either you accept it and accept that it sounds like that or you try to fix it.
pablo simon
Add nice textures. For example, when we sing 'It's another night to catch the bus', it's like he's yelling, it sounds like he's on the bus. It's only two votes in Soho.
Galen Ayers
It's great that we split into different languages. One of the things we've said before is that this is a post-Brexit, post-Covid album, so it's a celebration of Europe in the shadow of Brexit. Not a single person has said anything good to me about Brexit.
Gilesa Sibbalda
Lonely Town, especially in the movie, is a reminder of what real community means and when you sing when the tourists come, create carnage and then leave, I think that image highlights the importance of community and especially in light of the Brexit and xenophobia.
pablo simon
Yes, and the same situation applies to towns across the UK. The pubs close, then the post office disappears, the bank disappears and so on...
Galen Ayers
Now you have ghettos in central London made up of people with their fifth or sixth houses that they never get to. Nothing can survive if no one walks or lives in these areas...
"Nobody lives here anymore.
everyone is gone
oh pequeño pueblo
You lost your heart!
Translated from the English words of "Lonely Town" by Galen Ayers and Paul Simonon
"Can we make tomorrow another day?" is now available from sony
Watch them live:
7 June 2023 - Tabernacle, London
June 11, 2023 - La Maroquinerie, Paris
Images of:Dan Donovan